Free floating the tang on a Savage

[dloforo]

I just put my savage 10 in a Bell and Carlson stock and the tang isn't free floated in the least. I've heard that it is important for savage rifles to have a free floated tang. I shot a 5 round group that measured 0.89 MOA with a load that usually hovers around 0.5 to 0.7 MOA So not what I'm after but at least it's not a shotgun! I took a throat measurement a few nights ago and realized I've lost 0.01 so my bullets are jumping 0.035 rather than their usual 0.025. Maybe something to do with it? Anyway, if I get it shooting should I even bother with the tang or just go ahead and dremel out some material to free float it anyway? If so, what length of the tang needs to be free floated?

[DHuffman]

I just put my savage 10 in a Bell and Carlson stock and the tang isn't free floated in the least. I've heard that it is important for savage rifles to have a free floated tang. I shot a 5 round group that measured 0.89 MOA with a load that usually hovers around 0.5 to 0.7 MOA So not what I'm after but at least it's not a shotgun! I took a throat measurement a few nights ago and realized I've lost 0.01 so my bullets are jumping 0.035 rather than their usual 0.025. Maybe something to do with it? Anyway, if I get it shooting should I even bother with the tang or just go ahead and dremel out some material to free float it anyway? If so, what length of the tang needs to be free floated?

I would attempt to get the seating depth back in tune before I started worrying about the float on the tang. I do think the free float is pretty important though especially in regards to being able to tune the torque on the rear action screw.

Don't remove any material between the rear action screw and the trigger well, remove it from the trigger well back. I wouldn't get crazy with it either, it does not need a huge gap just "free floated" and I would wrap a piece of fine sandpaper around an appropriate size dowel and sand away taking care not to get ahead of the trigger well.   

[dloforo]

@HufD63 thanks a lot I'll give that a try. I've read posts about seting the front screw to the factory 40 in lbs then starting with the rear screw  at 5 I lbs, shooting groups tightening the rear screw 5 inlbs at a time. How do you like to do it?

[DHuffman]

@HufD63 thanks a lot I'll give that a try. I've read posts about seting the front screw to the factory 40 in lbs then starting with the rear screw  at 5 I lbs, shooting groups tightening the rear screw 5 inlbs at a time. How do you like to do it?

That's the general idea. Here's a very good article on it.

https://www.accurateshooter.com/technical-articles/savage-action-screw-torque-tuning/

 

[DHuffman]

I've had very good results, visibly better without measuring using this method.

[dloforo]

So this rifle has always shot pretty consistent groups. Right around 0.6 to 0.7 MOA with some sub 0.5 here and there.   Saturday I finally got to shoot it for the first time since putting it in the new stock. I shot 6 three round groups. Two were 0.24 MOA, one 0.57, one 0.6, one 0.7 and one at about an inch and not in that order. The first group was 0.24 and I think the second to last was the other 0.24 so really no pattern or deterioration as the groups were shot. Any chance this could be caused by the tang not being free floated? Any ideas or suggestions? Here are a couple of the groups and the rifle after the face lift.

[gman47564]

Good looking rifle.. I've always been told you want the tang floating on a savage action and then play with the torque on the rear screw to get the best groups.. but since the way you have the rifle set up now it shot groups in the 2's I doubt floating the tang will help.. you might play with the rear screw on it.. might help.. probably the best thing to do is shoot the crap out of it.. get use to how it likes to be drivin.. practice practice practice..

[DHuffman]

I would still play with the screw torque. I bet there will be a setting that's better than everything else.

[autoxforfun]

OK....I'm going to ask some stupid questions and perhaps share a process that I need to change.  

When I bed my Savage actions, I take a some material out between the three action screws and the barrel nut area.  I leave the rear of the action pretty much alone other than some light sanding.  I then put bedding material in the stock between the trigger relief and the tang well.  I actually put material in the well so the tang will displace some as the action is placed in the stock.  I think this violates the concept of 'free floating' the tang.  I then secure the action using some double sided studs that are thoroughly coated with mold release.  So my question.  When you say the tang needs to free floated, what are you referring to?  Is it the bottom edge or the front edge?  Does the tang need to not be touching anything?  I thought the rear side needed to up against the stock before the action bolts are tightened.  I have done this with all of my Savages and then followed the guideline referenced earlier to set the rear action bolt torque for best groups.  So far I've been happy or just know don't know a better way.  Thoughts?

Bob

[gman47564]

bob I could very well be wrong about this but... the way I take it...with a factory stock and the action tightened down in it can put upward pressure on the tang causing the action to flex a little... reliving the rear tang are lets the action relax if you will...  without bedding the stock theirs just points under the action making contact... no stress is induced as long as them points are where the screws go..  now take a stock and full bed it... that creates contact along the entire length of the action ..giving a better stress free foundation for the action to lay in... which in turn doesn't need the rear tang to float...because its not creating stress to the action...

[autoxforfun]

Thanks Grant.  That makes sense to me and is in-line with what I've read about bedding actions.  So when I read about the Tang needing to be free floating, I wasn't sure what to make of it......so I thought I would throw it out there and ask you guys.  But it is still interesting to note that adjusting the rear action screw does have an impact...even when it is fully bedded...ummmm?

Bob

[gman47564]

yes it does have a impact on groups... and the reason it does is beyond me.. lol... I don't know if it changes the vibration wave or what but I suspect it does...

[autoxforfun]

There are standing waves going in both directions from the chamber.  We tend to only think about the ones going down the barrel, but perhaps the ones traveling into the action have some effect.  Adjusting the rear screw may control how quickly they get damped out by the interface with the stock.  Don't know...just a thought.

Bob

[Ranger 188]

I've posted this article before, but for you Savage guy's a good read.
https://www.accurateshooter.com/technical-articles/savage-action-screw-torque-tuning/

[autoxforfun]

I follow this process pretty religiously and regularly verify it before an important shoot.  I have the targets to verify that it makes a difference.  It was written for Savage shooters with factory stocks.  So what happens when you bed the receiver and what about this 'Floating Tang' comment.  That is where for me it got confusing.  Perhaps I missed it, but the article doesn't seem to address this.