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Topic: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method (Read 583 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method

Reply #1
I read it. It reminded me of an info-mercial.

Nothing against all the great annealers out there, but I'll stick with the molten salt method. I"ve been reloading quite a while and noticed the necks getting stiff after a few loadings and necks would start splitting. Since I've been doing the salt bath, not a single split neck and I have a consistent seating force. Biggest downside so far is replacing the thermocouple after about a year.

Doing the whole, "See, we over-cooked it and still not annealed" seemed a bit like a side-show.

It works for me and I don't see a reason to change.

Re: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method

Reply #2
WOW, I'm curious what the salt bath annealers will have to say about that. I'm no scientist but that looks like pretty thorough testing with repeatable results over a variety of samples.

I was always skeptical about salt bath annealing but thinking it looked like way too big of a pain in the ass kept me from trying it.
Dave

Re: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method

Reply #3
I find it interesting they decided to test the salt bath method and not some of the more economical torch machines.
Dave

Re: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method

Reply #4
Wow, that is interesting.  So if I read it right, annealed brass, put once through a neck die with expander, will make it hard without even shooting. I wonder what the dies without expanders do for hardness, or a Lee collet die.

Re: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method

Reply #5
I find it interesting they decided to test the salt bath method and not some of the more economical torch machines.

They say they tested the salt bath method because."However, we have recently noticed that a process called molten salt bath annealing is gaining considerable attention."

As for not testing some of the more economical torch machines, they say.  "For those reloaders considering getting started on annealing, and who are on a budget, we would recommend a gas flame-based option." From that I gather that a gas flame-based option works reasonably well. Although probably not as accurate as their AMP machine. Maybe they'll test some of the gas flame machines or methods down the track.
Never try to teach a pig to sing...
 ...it wastes your time and annoys the pig!

Re: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method

Reply #6
It is interesting that in their conclusions, they stated that that the salt bath method gave the illusion of being properly annealed.  I personally have owned a Bench-Source and now have an AMP annealer.  I would get that factory annealed appearance with the Bench-Source (I always used tempilaq for calibration) but using the AMP, I only get slight discoloration.  Goes to show that looks can be deceiving.

Re: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method

Reply #7
Wow, that is interesting.  So if I read it right, annealed brass, put once through a neck die with expander, will make it hard without even shooting. I wonder what the dies without expanders do for hardness, or a Lee collet die.


Turning necks is even worse from what a shooter with a hardness tester tells me. He says it doesn't matter if you think you're going slow and keeping the heat down.
Dave

Re: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method

Reply #8
Sounds like it's now up to the salt bath manufacturers to prove induction annealing doesn't, and can't work  :o

Chris

Re: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method

Reply #9
I've got no dog in the fight. I have an Annealeze that I'm happy with and I may upgrade to an AMP at some point. Everyone has to use what they feel is working for them for the amount of $ they're willing to throw at it.

It's hard to ignore a scientific test versus "I can feel the difference" I know I can feel the difference with my Annealeze but have no idea what the actual hardness is on the neck, shoulder and body. More importantly I don't know if my process is getting each piece of brass the same.

Again it's all proportional to what you are trying to accomplish with your particular process.
Dave

Re: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method

Reply #10
I have the AMP unit, other than not having an automatic mode it's pretty slick. The calibration feature is hard to beat. I had the Bench-Source and was happy with it until it crossed my mind that running propane torches in the house, in a small space was risky,
Chris

Re: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method

Reply #11
Hopefully I'll find someone trustworthy I can send my brass and have it annealed for low cost. I don't think I'll ever shoot enough to pay for one .

Re: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method

Reply #12
Turning necks is even worse from what a shooter with a hardness tester tells me. He says it doesn't matter if you think you're going slow and keeping the heat down.
Very interesting as well.

 

Re: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method

Reply #13
not sure what to think of this... part of me thinks amp is pissed because someone else is getting some of their action...from what I can visually see is that different brands of brass anneals different... I use a cheap ole annealeeze and watch the brass close.. I want it to come off the flame just as the case starts to turn orange... whether that's right or wrong im not sure but it seems to work for me... some brands leave a well defined anneal mark while others not as defined... I assume that's do to the properties in the brass... as far as the salt bath goes … I don't have a clue... never used one.. nor have I used the amp.. I did a little research on flam temps... with a salt bath at 500 degrees c. that's close to 940 degrees f... a flame that is yellow is a little over a 1000 degrees f.. a blue flame like the annealeez has is 3000 plus degrees f... and it takes around 4 or 5 seconds to anneal a 6.5 creedmoor case with an annealeez.. so im not sure how a salt bath can do it in the same amount of time with a 940 degree f temperature .. but as I said ive never used one so I cant say it wont..
Grant

Re: Folks at AMP Annealing wrote a report on Salt Bath method

Reply #14
In a free market anyone can make a claim, and anyone is free to refute a claim.

Even though I own an AMP unit I have no idea if using it results in perfectly annealed brass or not, knowing just enough to be dangerous about electricity and modern control systems, I'm pretty confident it will result in consistently annealed brass.

Maybe salt bath is equally consistent, if not perfect.

 
Chris