The Creedmoor Forum

Bought a 20 round box of Berger 140 gn Hyb Tgt ammunition on sale, just to try it out.  Figure to use Berger and Lapua brass when my new rifle is finished being built.  And this ammunition uses Lapua brass.

Fired three rounds and it shoots good.   Was resizing the brass when I ran into great difficulty.  I used my normal process:  I wiped it clean, lubed it with Hornady One Shot, then put it in my Forster CoAx press and raised it up into my FL sizing die (decap pin and expander ball removed).   

I had to use great force to get the brass up into the die to size it and even greater force to get the brass back down out of the die.  It was even harder with the second piece I sized.  I thought I might end up with a stuck case situation.  After this I did not even try to resize the third piece.  Figured I better ask around to see if I am doing something wrong here. 

I know Lapua brass is stronger, thicker(?).  I mostly use Hornady brass with never an issue like this.   Can anyone explain why this happened?   Is this normal?   I clean my dies after using and I was using an RCBS die, that I always use. 

  f you removed the expander ball and you are requiring significantly more force to extract the case than to size it I would suspect a lube issue.  Hornady 1 shot is a good lube.  I would suggest spraying the inside of the die lightly, lube a case, and retry.  You may end up with a few lube 'dings' on the case but it should tell you if lack of lube is your issue.  How do the two cases that you sized look like?  Any unusual scratching/raised rings?

Yep, lube issue. A few more seconds with the spray. Or another coat. However you do it.

Thank you Rardoin and Dutchman.  I agree that it is likely a lube issue.  I normally spray and wait a while but this time I sprayed the lube and waited about a minute.  Not long enough and a difference to my norm. 

I did not see any damage done to the brass.  No dents or dings or other disformations.  There is nothing wrong with the press.  I've used the die to resize- Hornady, Winchester, Federal, Norma without a hitch, glitch or b....  .   So, the only difference other than the brass maker was my a change in my lube method.  Will 'mind my manners' with the lube next time.

Thanks again both of you.  lg

I agree with them both.  I only use the Imperial wax lube.
Never had an issue with it.
After sizing, usually clean the inside of the sizer and the first
time I reuse the sizer, I'll put a little more on the first case and after that
a light touch on every case after and no problems.
A few complaints recently have popped up here concerning
the Hornady one shot.  Wonder if they changed formulas or
something else. Did you see any scratches on the top 1/4 of the shoulder of the case?

Make your own. It's what I do and it works great.
Get some 99 percent alcohol from Amazon.
Get some liquid lanolin from Amazon.
Check out the video.

https://youtu.be/VgsimvLoddo

Quote from: Ranger 188 on June 10, 2019, 12:54:19 PMI agree with them both.  I only use the Imperial wax lube.
Never had an issue with it.
After sizing, usually clean the inside of the sizer and the first
time I reuse the sizer, I'll put a little more on the first case and after that
a light touch on every case after and no problems.
A few complaints recently have popped up here concerning
the Hornady one shot.  Wonder if they changed formulas or
something else. Did you see any scratches on the top 1/4 of the shoulder of the case?

Ranger, I did not see any marks, dents, dings, or other deformations on either piece.  I checked/inspected the brass for these things and pressure signs when I wipe it clean as a matter of habit before I run any of my brass thru the sizer.  (& for the record,  check for these things after firing too,    )  And, they came out looking the same.  No signs of any problems like that.   I am sure it is just how I applied the 1Shot and was not patient enough to let it set as long as I normally do.   Even the directions tell a guy to do that.  So, duh, the one time I did not follow the directions......... 

Thanx for the headsup on hearing problems with 1Shot.  That is news to me.  I'll keep an ear open for the drum beats on that.
   I have some Lee lube that I bought last winter and used that a few times but 1Shot is more convenient for me.   

Lg I have heard several guys putting their cases in a zip lock bag and spraying one shot in there liberally with them and rolling them around in the bag. I stand mine up in a case holder and spray on liberally from all 4 sides.. usually no issues with them.

Hornady 1shot is a lanolin lube in suspension.  I also 'roll my own' by making up liquid lanolin in 99% isopropyl alcohol.  One important caveat is to allow the solvent to completely evaporate before running them in the die.  This applies to the homebrew as well as the 1shot; if the case is wet when I run it in the die it WILL stick like you describe.  Were your cases still a little 'wet'?  If so then don't shy away of the 1shot unless you want to try the homebrew mentioned in 'dutchman's' post.  If you do you will notice that the lanolin does not truly dissolve in the alcohol to any great extent...more of a suspension so I shake my bottle before each application.  I spray 4-6 squirts in a gallon ziplock bag (if doing more than just a handful....if only 20 or so I use a quart bag), rub the bag around in my palms to distribute the lube throughout the bag, and put between 20-30 cases in and zip it close with most of the air removed.  I then 'massage' the cases in the bag by rubbing it around between my palms for a minute or two then dump the cases out in a clean container and let them dry while running a new batch.  I only put 2-3 squirts of lube in the bag between batches after the initial lubing.  The cases take about a minute to dry.  Less than $15 of product will lube probably 10K or more cases of 6.5 Creed or larger.

Robin

Quote from: rardoin on June 11, 2019, 06:28:36 AMHornady 1shot is a lanolin lube in suspension.  I also 'roll my own' by making up liquid lanolin in 99% isopropyl alcohol.  One important caveat is to allow the solvent to completely evaporate before running them in the die.  This applies to the homebrew as well as the 1shot; if the case is wet when I run it in the die it WILL stick like you describe.  Were your cases still a little 'wet'?  If so then don't shy away of the 1shot unless you want to try the homebrew mentioned in 'dutchman's' post.  If you do you will notice that the lanolin does not truly dissolve in the alcohol to any great extent...more of a suspension so I shake my bottle before each application.  I spray 4-6 squirts in a gallon ziplock bag (if doing more than just a handful....if only 20 or so I use a quart bag), rub the bag around in my palms to distribute the lube throughout the bag, and put between 20-30 cases in and zip it close with most of the air removed.  I then 'massage' the cases in the bag by rubbing it around between my palms for a minute or two then dump the cases out in a clean container and let them dry while running a new batch.  I only put 2-3 squirts of lube in the bag between batches after the initial lubing.  The cases take about a minute to dry.  Less than $15 of product will lube probably 10K or more cases of 6.5 Creed or larger.

Robin

This is exactly me.  I use a use an 8 to 1 ratio of lanolin and put 25 cases at a time in a Ziploc.  I used to use one shot and in my opinion the homemade stuff is noticeably smoother and requires less force in the press.

I have to ask if those of you who use the Ziploc bag method end up having to clean the brass when done? I hate repeating steps, since I clean first, I try to keep the lube where I want it and not where I don't (inside the necks). I use an alcohol wipe to clean the lube off after sizing.

I'm new to the 6.5CM (assembling an LR platform right now) but not to sizing with the Forster Co-Ax.  I had an issue (i.e., multiple stuck 300BLK cases) early on with the spray+ziploc method and hit Forster up about it.  They sent me a free sample of their own oil.  Call me a corporate stooge but after using that I've never had a stuck case since.  And it's not like I'm getting any kickbacks when a bottle of the stuff,  more than I will probably use in my lifetime, costs a mere $10.  I also use it to lube & protect my press, trimmer, etc.  Just wanted to pass that along, as I said, not an expert but hope to help.

Quote from: bikemutt on June 11, 2019, 06:40:02 PMI have to ask if those of you who use the Ziploc bag method end up having to clean the brass when done? I hate repeating steps, since I clean first, I try to keep the lube where I want it and not where I don't (inside the necks). I use an alcohol wipe to clean the lube off after sizing.

I know some people will tumble the cases in 'dry' media and it will remove any lube.  I rinse in fast drying mineral spirits.  I process too many cases at a time to wipe them individually (but if I load 20-30 for a test and have to size I will hand wipe them).  In reality most any lube will work if applied correctly.  I like lanolin based lube because it was the gold standard in the brass wire pulling industry for many years and I can mix it myself.  Personal preference.

Quote from: bikemutt on June 11, 2019, 06:40:02 PMI have to ask if those of you who use the Ziploc bag method end up having to clean the brass when done? I hate repeating steps, since I clean first, I try to keep the lube where I want it and not where I don't (inside the necks). I use an alcohol wipe to clean the lube off after sizing.

There is such a small amount of residue that I do not think you really need to remove it, however, my normal procedure is to ultrasonic clean after annealing, then size and trim, and then put the finished cases in a dry tumbler for polishing before loading.  This does remove any residue, and also removes any small brass shavings, but mostly it makes the brass really shiny, which I'm sure adds extra velocity

'Case (pun intended) closed'.   Just getting back and to report the outcome.   It was my not being patient enough to let the 'One Shot' lube dry enough before sizing, that caused my problem.   Few days ago, I lubed the one case I had left, used patience and let it dry the normal time I do, and sized it without a hitch, glitch or b.....   

Thought to report back here, how it turned out,  out of courtesy and thanx to all of you who replied to my post.  lg